Hammer Hunter

[Bassfish1952]

Does anyone have any experience with the 88gr Hammer Hunter or any of the other ones in 6mm.




Thanks

[CZ527 Guy]

Not the 88 grain hammer hunter though I did give the 87 grain Absolute Hammer a try last fall. Load work up was very easy to find a higher velocity accuracy load right at 3000 FPS in the 22" bolt action. Took two doe at roughly 100 yards. Boiler room resulted in a 80ish yard death run.

What attracted me to the Absolute hunter last fall was availability in the 1st place. Reputation for expanding & fragmenting at lower velocities. will likely be my hunting bullet for years to come.

[Bassfish1952]

Not the 88 grain hammer hunter though I did give the 87 grain Absolute Hammer a try last fall. Load work up was very easy to find a higher velocity accuracy  load right at 3000 FPS in the 22" bolt action. Took two doe at roughly 100 yards. Boiler room resulted in a 80ish yard death run.

What attracted me to the Absolute hunter last fall was availability in the 1st place. Reputation for expanding & fragmenting at lower velocities. will likely be my hunting bullet for years to come.

Interesting , what would be your comfort distance with that round for hunting ?

Thanks

[CZ527 Guy]

I have not shot the round much. Thus very much, still n the learning curve. Number of factors slowing me down with the learning curve, not the least of which would be cost per bullet. I am hoping to prove to myself that this round can be very effective out to 300 yards.

Though I have not put it to work at anything over 100 yards yet. So truth be told, I am for the most part still speculating along with you thus far.
I intend to get out & shoot at various velocities at water jugs in a series, with the intent of catching the deformed bullet to evaluate to get a better idea of terminal performance.

[Bassfish1952]

I have not shot the round much. Thus very much, still n the learning curve. Number of factors slowing me down with the learning curve, not the least of which would be cost per bullet. I am hoping to prove to myself that this round can be very effective out to 300 yards.

Though I have not put it to work at anything over 100 yards yet. So truth be told, I am for the most part still speculating along with you thus far.
I intend to get out & shoot at various velocities at water jugs in a series, with the intent of catching the deformed bullet to evaluate to get a better idea of terminal performance.

Well their website says NOT for beginners, so with out more  data. . Not sure I want to do anything BUT now that I have the equipment it does sound like a bullet I could like and 300 yds is my stopping point

[CZ527 Guy]

Yes the lack of load data does prove to be a bit intimidating. Depending on how much time you put in to shooting & reloading this summer, you may evolve rather quickly into a rather experienced reloader. If you are able to interpret pressure signs by the use of the Magneto speed & evaluating bolt lift, primer signs I am relatively the skill will come relatively quick for you.

I was skeptical on the Hammers at 1st. though with time I have come to understand the designed in advantages that can allow this monolithic perform more so similar th a cup & core bullet design. I am of the opinion that the Hammer design may be the better monolithic option on the market for the hunting I do.

Yes the price is a deterrent, though my limited experience has suggested to me that They are a very viable option. Lack of load data is a substantial hold back though.

[Bassfish1952]

Yes the lack of load data does prove to be a bit intimidating. Depending on how much time you put in to shooting & reloading this summer, you may evolve rather quickly into a rather experienced reloader. If you are able to interpret pressure signs by the use of the Magneto speed & evaluating bolt lift, primer signs I am relatively the skill will come relatively quick for you.

I was skeptical on the Hammers at 1st. though with time I have come to understand the designed in advantages that can allow this monolithic perform more so similar th a cup & core bullet design.  I am of the opinion that the Hammer design may be the better monolithic option on the market for the hunting I do.

Yes the price is a deterrent, though my limited experience has suggested to me that They are a very viable option. Lack of load data is a substantial hold back though.

Couple of questions

OAL of cartridge and how far off lands ? 

What FPS were you getting and if I were to use Hornady load data and start at the lowest load possible as a beginner would that put me in safe area ?


Thanks

[CZ527 Guy]

Not sure how much I care to share, For your purposes & others always proceed with caution & work up from a low point Watch for signs of pressure. Absolute Hammers are still very new to me / us. What worked in my gun may not work in yours, so I assume no liability. Work up your own data with extreme caution. This is intended for anyone considering the info below, not just the Op.

With the Absolute Hammer, the ogive will not touch the lands due to the drive band designe,

Due to the drive band designe, less material is being deformed. So we may expect less pressure when comparing similar weight bullets & same powder charges. Expect this is difficult for all of us to adjust to. I am still having difficulty to tell the truth.
"These bullets require faster than normal powders for the cartridge and bullet weight. Load with extreme

caution."

So Hornady data is challenging to decipher on how useful that data is or how we may apply that data. Healthy dose of caution & focus is called for.

I settled on IMR 8208 XBR powder due to stability, fill ratio & burn rate to work up a load in my bolt action rifle. Started with a 2.260" OAL or mag length to start off with. Started low & worked up slowly to near 27 grains to achieve 3000FPS. Without the Magneto speed no signs of pressure were realized. As I reached 3000 FPS Velocity gains were noticeably less as I recall. Yet no pressure signs with bolt lift or primer forme were noticed. I opted to stop at 3000 FPS.

The Absolute Hammers are supposed to be very seating depth tolerant. Still I opted to experiment with slightly shorter OAL to evaluate accuracy change. A better accuracy node was realized with a slightly shorter OAL.

Due to expense of these bullets I tried to be as efficient as possible when working up a load. Only one round was loaded at each charge weight when working up the load at 100 yards. Once I settled on 3000fps muzzle velocity; (measured with the magneto speed) The OAL was experimented with, in that I tried .015" & .030" shorter.
With 3 shot groups, accuracy seemed to improve with a little shorter OAL.

Expect to see a Memorial day promotion next week, so this could be coming up on a good time to make a purchase if you know what direction you want to go.

As I recall, I reached out to Hammer for bullet recommendations & they recommended a lighter bullet. Not sure if they wanted me to strive for more velocity or they did not understand the ARC has the twist to stabilize a longer bullet. As I recall they recommended a lighter bullet than I settled on with the 87 grain absolute Hammer. Your milage may vary.

[grayfox]

Actually CZ mentions one thing that I've seen and heard on, which is, hornady apparently says their new CX/Gmx all copper bullets are made of an alloy that is softer than ones like barnes, so powder charges don't have to be reduced with these hornady pills. Now I'm not certain of this but just mention it...

If that be the case I might (if I had hammers, which I don't) use the 90 gmx/cx hornady data, starting low but expecting hammer MV to be slightly higher than the cx, load for load, since it is 3 gr lighter. A 3 gr weight delta IMO wouldn't rule out using that data, as some bullets show loads for pills with a 5 gr wt. delta, eg: the 95 sst and 100's of hornady in the 6Arc.

All this is theory. I personally don't plan to use any of the lead free b/c I'm concerned they might be just a tad light at 6Arc velocities, just my opinion however.
Interesting the 3000 MV fps for CZ.

[Bassfish1952]

Actually CZ mentions that I've seen and heard on, is, hornady apparently says their new CX/Gmx all copper bullets are made of an alloy that is softer than ones like barnes, so powder charges don't have to be reduced with these hornady pills.  Now Im not certain of this but just mention it...

If that be the case I might (if I had hammers, which I don't) use the 90 gms hornady data, starting low but expecting hammer MV to be slightly higher than the cx, load for load, since it is 3 gr lighter.  A 3 gr delta IMO wouldn't rule out using that data, as some bullets show loads for pills with a 5 gr delta, eg: the 95 sst and 100's of hornady in the 6Arc.

All this is theory.  I personally don't plan to use any of the lead free b/c I'm concerned they might be just a tad light at 6Arc velocities, just my opinion however.
Interesting the 3000 MV fps for CZ.

I bought my reloading gear to just do the 90gr CX/GMX so load work up with them then a direct comparison to the 87gr Absolute, 83gr Shock and the 88 gr shock would not be hard for me. 
I include the Shock bullets after reading Hammers product statement about the 400yd extended range being the reason for the smaller hollow point for the Absolute.


Thanks

[Bassfish1952]

Not sure how much I care to share, For your purposes & others always proceed with caution & work up from a low point Watch for signs of pressure. Absolute Hammers are still very new to me / us. What worked in my gun may not work in yours, so I assume no liability. Work up your own data with extreme caution. This is intended for anyone considering the info below, not just the Op.

With the Absolute Hammer, the ogive will not touch the lands due to the drive band designe,

Due to the drive band designe, less material is being deformed. So we may expect less pressure when comparing similar weight bullets & same powder charges. Expect this is difficult for all of us to adjust to. I am still having difficulty to tell the truth.
"These bullets require faster than normal powders for the cartridge and bullet weight. Load with extreme

caution."

So Hornady data is challenging to decipher on how useful that data is or how we may apply that data. Healthy dose of caution & focus is called for.

I settled on IMR 8208 XBR powder due to stability, fill ratio & burn rate to work up a load in my bolt action rifle. Started with a 2.260" OAL or mag length to start off with. Started low & worked up slowly to near 27 grains to achieve 3000FPS. Without the Magneto speed  no signs of pressure were realized. As I reached 3000 FPS Velocity gains were noticeably less as I recall. Yet no pressure signs with bolt lift or primer  forme were noticed. I opted to stop at 3000 FPS.

The Absolute Hammers are supposed to be very seating depth tolerant. Still I opted to experiment with slightly shorter OAL to evaluate accuracy change. A better accuracy node was realized with a slightly shorter OAL.

Due to expense of these bullets I tried to be as efficient as possible when working up a load. Only one round was loaded at each charge weight when working up the load at 100 yards. Once I settled on 3000fps  muzzle velocity; (measured with the magneto speed) The OAL was experimented with, in that I tried .015" & .030" shorter.
With 3 shot groups, accuracy seemed to improve with a little shorter OAL.

Expect to see a Memorial day promotion next week, so this could be coming up on a good time to make a purchase if you know what direction you want to go.

As I recall, I reached out to Hammer for bullet recommendations & they recommended a lighter bullet. Not sure if they wanted me to strive for more velocity or they did not understand the ARC has the twist to stabilize a longer bullet. As I recall they recommended a lighter bullet than I settled on with the 87 grain absolute Hammer. Your milage may vary.

Thanks if they go on sale next week I may grab some of the 87gr Absolute and 88gr Shock to compare to Hornady after I do my work up on their 90CX/GMX. 
It looks like starting at the bottom of the Hornady load for 90CX and working up would be safe and a good learning experience . I'm going to my local reloader supply store next week , I have Leverevolution but may check on different powder that would work with 90CX and or the hammer bullets

1 more question, Hammer recommends a Magnum Primer did you use one ?

Thanks for your insight

[grayfox]

Well for an AR that would be the cci 450 for me, which I do for ARs. For my 22" uintah (bolt) the Fed 205 match is what works best so far.
The fed "regular" primers seem to be on the hotter side of "normal", but they are very consistent at least for me.
So AR, cci 41 or 450 would be my choice.
If someone were to be loading those 80's in a 243 or 6 CM esp with a ball powder, or such with a bigger case, then maybe "magnum" would be the choice, idk. I load mostly 95-100's in my 243 and my 6 CM is w/ 107 smk's, so not a worry for me.

The 6Arc, with a small case, I'd stick with mag's for the AR for the harder cup. for a bolt, whatever shoots better.

[CZ527 Guy]

As for propellents for the 90 gr CX data I am seeing suggest Power pro varmint may be my first consideration. Though I would be a bit surprised if you were to find PPV on the shelf. Ramshot Tac would be a consideration & more likely to be available. H4895 is just a great all around powder that may be on the shelf though availability is a real question mark as well.

CFE 223 may do well with the 90 gr CX though is so close to LVR I would consider something faster if you want to use the same powder for the Absolute Hammer.

For what it is worth My Lyman manual list a max load of 27 gr of IMR 8208 XBR for the 90 grain E-tip. Velocity in a 24" barrel is listed at 2779 in a bolt action 24" barrel.

I am really under the weather today with a cold like bug. Perhaps I should not be weighing in till I look a little deeper. Suspect I had went higher than 27 gr of the 8208 XBR when loading the Absolute Hammers to achieve the 3000 FPS.

[Bassfish1952]

As for propellents for the 90 gr CX data I am seeing suggest Power pro varmint may be my first consideration. Though I would be a bit surprised if you were to find PPV on the shelf. Ramshot Tac would be a consideration & more likely to be available. H4895 is just a great all around powder that may be on the shelf though availability is a real question mark as well.

CFE 223 may do well with the 90 gr CX though is so close to LVR I would consider something faster if you want to use the same powder for the Absolute Hammer.

For what it is worth My Lyman manual list a max load of 27 gr of IMR 8208 XBR for the 90 grain E-tip. Velocity in a 24" barrel is listed at 2779 in a bolt action 24" barrel.

I am really under the weather today with a cold like bug. Perhaps I should not be weighing in till I look a little deeper. Suspect I had went higher than 27 gr of the 8208 XBR when loading the Absolute Hammers to achieve the 3000 FPS.

Hope you're better soon.

My magneto speed is out for delivery today so the last part of the puzzle is in place. Now it's time for the range and to see what is what. I'm going to try the indoor range and see if I can compare my first loads to factory 103's . Let you guys know how I did sometime this week.